A Few of My Most Common Emails… Answered!
First off – thank you to all of you who commented or sent me a personal email in reference to my 25 Things about Mark Hansen post! It was very encouraging and will help me come a bit more out of my friggin shell! :-) Today – I’m actually going to talk ab0ut a few of the most common emails I get… and instead of continually sending the same answers, I will come out of the closet right here and say it!
Are you Still Building BANS Sites?
Rochelle even talked about this on her blog earlier this week… For myself, the short answer is No, or at least not very often! The long answer is that even though I DO still have some good BANS sites, I’ve lost quite a bit of interest in it since using phpBay and a few other store builder type products.
In my honest opinion.. each has a place where it excels, but with BANS its just too easy to build thin sites that run too high a risk of being dropped from the index. I am also convinced there is something within the bans 3.0 version that is instantly picked up by the Google algo, because I have seen a BUNCH of BANS 3.0 sites that are great quality, but still deindexed. The ONLY bans sites I still work on, are version 2.0 stores upgraded to 3.0, and I hacked quite a bit out of the index and frontcontrol files, to reduce the code print.
Did I give up on BANS? No… the few sites I do still update do OK, but don’t look anything like the types of stores built 1-2 years ago!
The trick for me with BANS or phpBay is to build 1 page at a time, versus mass producing a catalog from the feed. It FORCES you to create a quality page, versus a point and click catalog.
What do You Think of This Site?
Not a day goes by that I don’t get at least one email, asking me for an opinion on a site. 99% of the time, I answer them… and the answer is not always welcome! Here are just a few VERY basic guidelines that I USE on many of my own sites… if your site follows these initial guidelines, GREAT… if not, you may have some more work to do! :-)
Qualifier: If you plan on getting search engine traffic:
- NO (Yes, Zero) or VERY FEW (I’m talking like 4 or less) auction or product listings on your home page! Use the home page to inform visitors of all the stuff they are going to find within your site. A short paragraph about each of your categories, with a link to that category is perfect!
- NO MORE than 4-8 product listings on your site pages! Fill your site with INFORMATION and let the listings serve as a compliment to the content!
- Eliminate the Pagination on your pages, you know those links that say… < Page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 > next etc at the bottom of the listings. Get rid of them… they do nothing but generate more duped content and take the value away from the original landing page. If you write 500 words of unique content on your page… why do you want that same unique content spread across 10 other pages, nofollow is not perfect and they are still very likely to be indexed anyway!
- If you use adsense, use just one code block above the fold or in the middle of your CONTENT articles!
- MAKE SURE your listings are clearly marked as eBay auctions, versus representing that it is your online store!
- If you are not writing your own content, buying unique content, or rewriting content you find to make it you own… you will get no visitors from search! Period. Cyberhubonline.com has articles for $1.50 per 250 word article. They may not be perfect, but they are unique and a great starting point for you to fill in the gaps and get content for your pages.
- A good basic structure to use on your listing pages is this:
- 100-250 words of unique content on top!
- MAX 4-8 listings (I use 4, in a column format, and would only use 8 if they were columnar as well! Listings in the row format carry on too far down the page)
- 50+ words of unique content, or summary paragraphs to other categories within the same parent category!
There are many other things I try to do on my own sites, but these are the most basic that will have an immediate impact on your site quality. Do I do it 100% of the time? No.. unfortunately my head runs in too many different directions and I end up playing clean up more often that I like to admit!
Will Google Like This Site?
Again… in my own opinion, aside from sites that are found through triggers the algo, Google will be at least the second person to have manually reviewed your site BEFORE it suffers any penalties! We all do all this work to rank well and beat out many others in the search results… guess what? ALL those people you rank in front of are now jealous, and if they have been working for years to get their site to the top of the serp’s, they will simply click that little button in Google and report your site as spam, which triggers a Google employee to jump in and decide if it is or not!
Google is very aggressively communicating with webmasters and asking them to report sites they think are spam! Just go read at Matt Cutts site for a few weeks and look back through his blog… not one month goes by that he does not plea for spam reports in some form or another! If you don’t think people will report it… read the comments on his posts!
Ask yourself a few questions and you will KNOW if it would survive a manual review:
- Am I providing unique content that deserves to be in the index?
- Would the top 20 sites in the same niche, think my site is useful to readers?
- Are Other Sites linking to mine as a resource for the niche?
- Would I post a link to my site on Matt Cutts blog comments and ask for a review?
If you answered no to any of them… chances are it wouldn’t survive a manual review.
Will Doing XXXX Get My Site Back into the Google Index?
I will tell you from first hand experience… if the only thing you did was build an auction listing site and it was dropped from the index (Assuming you didn’t go link spam crazy, use blackhat methods, etc) you are gonna have to get rid of it and start over before you request reinclusion! It sucks… but it is what it is!
You can take the route I took and waste hundreds of hours on it, with no guarantee it will be good enough for G, you can accept that it can survivie without google traffic, or you can cut your losses and walk away to build a better site in the same niche and not make the same mistakes, even though you may not have a clue what they were, that got it there. IF the only thing that got it deindexed was that it had bans on it… guess what?
In my own case and with more almost a full year of reinclusion requests on a very clean site, I gave up! I have tried EVERYTHING to get the site in question back into the index and it’s still not there! Sure, Gbot comes in every day and indexes the crap out of the content, but they still don’t list in the engine.
- I have noindexed all auction listing pages specifically for gbot
- I have completely blocked gbot in the robots file – but it still comes EVERY day! (Which is just friggin wrong to begin with)
- I have continued building content that gets linked from other sites at the rate of 2-3 links every week.
- I added a blog and built blog based content versus any other store type pages.
The list goes on and on to what I have done with this site over the past year of trying… and I finally tossed in the towel and just built a new site, since it is something I am passionate about!
As I add 1 new page at a time, I go back to the old site and 301 the old page to the new site to make sure the friendly engines have a place to send their visitors, and the link juice may or may not, pass over.
What are You Using to Make Money?
Listed from MOST often to LEAST often!
- WordPress, installed through my Hostgator Fantastico!
- phpBay for sprinking in auction listings. I noindex ALL pages that contain more than 4 auction listings! 20% discount code: 24D0955707 still active as far as I know!
- phpOStock for the same… but feeding from the FAST growing Overstock affiliate program!
- Review Site plugin to give a way for readers to provide feedback and supply a pagfe with MORE unique content! :-)
- CarP – To grab a feed(s), completely rewrite it, or build mashups. (There is a technical curve with CarP, but once you get it right… its good shit!)
- Caffeinated Content, for finding topics to inspire me to write my own. The ONLY time I use articles through CC without editing them is when I build the first few pages of a site and want the blog categories to show up and help me with site setup. I don’t delete them when I’m done, I just start adding my own unique content and bury them deeper in the archives, under all my own unique content.
- CyberHubOnline.com for getting dirt cheap 250 word articles.
- Sebatian Schnieder (email: info@srsconsulting.de) for HIGH Quality, highly researched and professional articles! They arent cheap at $16 each, but the quality is book worthy!
- BANS – Yes, on a limited scale, I still use BANS due to its simplicity for building full stores in one click. The trick is to do it one page at a time, by immediately going into your store pages and turning all of them OFF, until you can edit them!
As I was writing this I realized there is ALOT more I use… which just tells me I am scattered again! Time to reel my head in and focus some more!
Mark
Previously Published Articles You May Like to Read:
- Digging Out of The Google Supplemental Index
- Moving Forward from a Bad Week
- eBay Affiliate Program Doesn’t want your Lame Traffic!







Thanks for the info Mark:
Great to see what methods you still find viable.
I also am getting away from BANS as I’ve discussed with you.
Time to explore more options!
Mark , great post ..on the deindexing part . Has anyone here had any luck with getting Google to reinstate a site that has been deindexed?? I have a few that have been Xed and would love to know if it is worth keeping them or just trash and start over…I have done no bad stuff ,, just early on some of them were very thin. Thanks
Mark, Great info….my site was indexed when I first put it up, then deindexed just when I figured out how to work with it. Now I’m using the site to build up my skills for the next one. I’ll see what works and doesn’t. I’ll start a new site, same niche, when I’m ready. Turning off store pages until ready….very good idea. Wish I had done that. Lots more to do, but I’m up for it. Thanks!
Otis,
I’ve never had any luck getting my deindexed sites reindexed. I have let several domains go because of this and just haven’t found the time to recreate the sites.
Rochelle
@Rochelle
Thanks for the info, I was sure that would be the answer as it was with Mark’s site that he worked so hard trying to get back in. I have already blocked the sites and archived them from epn acct. I was just curious ..and thanks again
Mark
Great post, it’s nice to see someone else is getting similar emails :).
Seriously though, I have to agree with BANS, I love the tool, always have and always will but there was definitely something in the v3.0 upgrade that made things go a little wrong. It’s been ages since I built a BANS site, I find that if I build with phpBay I work harder at it and usually build a better site. This said though, I did start putting a site together yesterday just because I had missed doing it :).
Have a good weekend
Ben
Yo Marky Mark.. During ShoeMoney’s webinar, he mentioned if you were building sites for Google, you had already lost… at least I think it was along those lines.. do you think he was saying not worry about G at all, or just not try to impress G and let it occur naturally.
I had a site that was also dropped by G but is still # 1 for the keyword phrase that I want at Yahoo…
Is it a “fact” that one deindexed site at G will hurt your other sites? I know you touched on that before, but hell, if I get traffic, good traffic from Yahoo and the site is making $$, why worry about G?
Secondly, when you spoke about Pagination and having the Page 1, page 2 etc etc.. Are you saying only have 4 to 8 listings for the category and not give the visitor all of the products available? If clicking on the next page, page 2, page 3 etc to view more products doesn’t change the url, how does that show up as duplicate?
maybe i’m totally confused about that??
Mark,
Great stuff and way to put some stuff down so we can all learn from them. Kind of like an FAQ post-LOL!
I’ve got a long standing BANS site that I’m going to need to go back to and drop a bunch of categories from it and add unique content to the remaining ones. That should help bolster it a bit.
I originally built it before I had any clue what the hell I was doing and now I’m having to fix it like you mentioned.
Jeff
Thanks for the update.
Hi Mark
Great information here , if a website gets reported as spam by another wm , does Google inform you that your site has been reported?
I think that Google should inform you and also who reported your site.
@ Otis & Jake –
Just to support what Rochelle said… no luck at all here either. The one site of mine that was out, then back in the index, IMHO, was a fluke, and not related to be dropped but something else… because I have worked my ass off to get others back in, with no luck at all.
That said… Matt Cutts has stated that when they look at reinclusion, they want to be 100% that whatever got the site dropped will not happen again. (link to a LONG reading post)
… if you have several sites that are dropped, or several similar sites… what would tell the gods at G that you aren’t going to do it again?
@ Jake – I know what you are saying about the Shoe comment… but keep in mind the context of what he was saying. He blogs on his site daily, sometimes, 3-4 times a day, and networks heavily on social nets, forums, etc… IF you are doing all that for your BANS site – sure, why worry about G?
@ Jake in ref to the paging… let me dig deeper, maybe I missed something and you may be right about it!
@ Doug – G will not come out and tell you… during the reinclusion process, they may. I doubt they would say who tho!
I always appreciate your writings Mark. I had to learn everything, I use BANS and I like it, because I know how to work with it. The thought of learning something new scares me, but eventually I will. I have learned so much already by reading what you write. And maybe someday i will have the courage to try WordPress.
Mark
Forgot to ask previously , Why only 1 adsense block?
@ Francine – Once you build your FIRST site with WordPress and see how easy it is to use, you will never look back…
@ Doug – Like everything else in life, I have found that most things work best in moderation.
I have seen sites that are like this:
Adsense Block <> Content <> Adsense Block <> BANS Listings <> Adsense Block <> Banner Ad <> Adsense Block
The BEST thing to do on any page is remove ALL ad based content… ALL adsense, ALL banners, ALL listings… and look at what you have left! THAT is what will drive the sites success…
Mark
Mark,
do you still use popshops? if not, why did you quit?
Put in an order at cyberhubonline, it took a little longer than the est. time (est. 3 days, actual 6 days), but I was really impressed by the quality of the article for the price. I was expecting to have to do some rewriting, but no need. Paid $3 for a 500 word semi-technical article. Way better than the $12/article price I paid at elance from a so-called expert writer. I will use them again. Thanks for the tip!
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